New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

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New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Polish-Jack » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:30 pm

I bought a 98 yzf600r last season as a first bike and am learning to ride on it. I live in Canada so it goes into storage for the winter as only the most insane rider's here go about all year round. I thought I wintered properly but failed to remove the fuel from the system before putting the bike away and now it's time to clean the carbs. This is my first time dealing with a carbureted system so I would like some clarification on how to deal with the jets.

All the jets that are removable by default do not have any adjustment, correct? I can remove the main jet and pilot jet clean them out and screw them back in until the bottom out. By default the one screw that can be adjusted is the one that comes sealed from factory by a little disc in its housing.

My plan is to clean the carbs but leave the sealed area alone, if there is a problem after the cleaning then I can break the seal and fall deeper down the rabbit hole.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Pepperoni » Sat Apr 15, 2017 11:02 pm

Yes, your correct, the jets don't have adjustments to them (no locknuts or range of adjustment, just "snuggly tight"). The air mixture screws are under those brass caps that you mentioned. Yes, you may very well need to clean them, too. The caps are there to keep consumers with mucking with them that can affect settings made at the factory to make sure the engines meet emissions standards. They are simple to remove:

1) Remove the carbs from the intake boots (obviously after removing the airbox!).
2) With a small drill bit (about 1/16th" or 1.5mm), carefully drill through the cap--just until the bit goes through! It's not very far. If you let the drill just punch through, then you could damage the airscrew and that's a problem.
3) Take a steel screw and screw it into the hole a couple of turns.
4) With some pliers/Vice-Grips, grab the screw head and work the cap out of the hole.

It's pretty easy to do. No, you don't need to replace the caps... :nono

If you do this, make sure to be careful when removing the airscrew: there's the screw, a spring, a metal washer, and a rubber o-ring (in that order) and make sure they go back in reverse order (o-ring, washer, spring, screw). Also, before you remove them (BEFORE!!!!), carefully screw them all the way IN, counting exactly how many turns it takes on each one (down to the quarter-turn, as in 2 turns, or 2.5, or 2.75, or whatever). Quite often, you'll find they aren't all the same, so be sure to right it down (I usually work from left to right, except when I'm in the Middle East). IF you are happy with the way your bike ran before the winter, then make sure to put them back to the same position (screw them all the way in, then back them out the number of turns you wrote down). If not, I think the factory adjustment in the manual is 2.5 turns out on all cylinders. That's why I use (with a carb jet kit) and I've been very happy with the results. YMMV.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Polish-Jack » Sat Apr 15, 2017 11:32 pm

Thank you for the clarification. I also managed to find the Service Manual for the motorcycle and it states 1 3/8 as the default setting. What confused me the most was that they call the sealed screw a Pilot Screw and one of the jets a Pilot jet so I just wanted to double check.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Pepperoni » Sun Apr 16, 2017 12:00 am

I don't think anybody here has the airscrew/air-fuel mixture screw/pilot screw set at 1-3/8 turns out. That is to keep the mixture lean at low throttle in order to keep it "clean" to meet emissions standards.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Riceburner » Sun Apr 16, 2017 12:04 am

Where are you? I'm in Toronto and have my carbs stock and have never drained them for winter storage. Granted I used to be a 8-10 month rider, so storage isn't all that long.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Polish-Jack » Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:45 am

I'm out West in British Columbia, in the Okanagan Valley. Winter here starts around late October and the snow clears around early to mid April. Five or six months in storage, give or take.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby tuning-forks » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:48 pm

Did you fire it up and are having issues?
Otherwise I'd just put some Seafoam in the tank and run it.
Like Riceburner said, they don't always gum up just because they weren't drained.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Riceburner » Sun Apr 16, 2017 4:08 pm

+1 Run some SeaFoam thru it first....maybe even twice. Years ago(almost a decade) I had a bit of a bogging issue. SF cleared it up and it has never returned yet.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Polish-Jack » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:54 am

It worked! The bike runs better now than before the troubles started. I am pleased.

I do have a question about the sealed Jet Screws and synchronising though. As I understand synchronising the carb and adjusting the Jet Screw both modify idle, but in different ways. How do you know when one is set properly in order to set the other properly. I don't know if I am making myself clear but that's probably because I don't think I quite understand what it is that the Jet Screw does and how to adjust it properly and not just giving it 2.5 turns from fully seated and trusting that that is best.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby tuning-forks » Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:52 pm

Sync is adjusting the throttle plate (in the throat of each carb) so that each cylinder creates the same vacuum at idle.
If it was a single carb bike, you would adjust the idle speed by opening or closing the throttle plate. With 4 carbs, you adjust each plate so they are all matched. The sync tool helps you do this matching.

The mixture screw adjusts the fuel/air mix at idle. If you have expensive emission testing equipment you can adjust them precisely. Otherwise it is trial and error and looking at the plug colour to see what effect the fuel screw adjustment has made. In general, it seems most have found a setting of 2 turns out for the outside 2 cylinders, and 2.5 turns out for the inner 2 cylinders, gives the best results. You can trust them or do your own trial and error settings.
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Re: New rider fail: now cleaning carbs. Need clarification.

Postby Pepperoni » Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:14 am

tuning-forks wrote:You can trust them or do your own trial and error settings.


TRUST NO ONE!


(Sorry, it's a compulsion...)

FYI re: carb synch: it IS important because it does result in a smoother running engine, less vibration, better mileage, shinier hair, stronger enamel on your teeth... And, it's actually not that difficult. There's a lot of different gauges available (don't get one that uses mercury (if they even make them anymore)). And, there is at least one thread on here describing how to whip up your own DIY gauge. I have a Morgan Carbtune (II?) from England, it's pretty cool, it uses balanced, polished steel rods instead of fluid so there's no chance of spilling or having fluid sucked back into the engine (both a Bad Problem if it happens with mercury-filled gauges--you literally create a toxic waste superfund site).
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